Need feedback?.. Wanna train? I gotchu. - Page 2 - Lets Beef

Skizzo · #11 10-04-2018, 01:38 PM

@UnEtH1CaL You have a very unique style. I read that verse this morning but I wanted to wait till I had a minute to break it down properly and offer some advice.

First of all.
You have a very unique and creative approach to personals, your storyline is extremely effective and the way you flow one concept to another within that storyline is extremely fluent. That being said.. I think where you lack, is in the fact that sometimes you get lost in that storyline and sacrifice actual concepts for them. Its kind of like you're telling a story, but its just that.. A story. Youre not making concepts out of those personals sometimes, just telling the people about the personal. Which sometimes comes off as a really dope concept, but other times it comes out as a long drawn and winded personal that takes too long to reach its peak. Let me give you some examples.

Example:

He says he's depressed, we ALL JUST IGNORE HIM. He say's a mess, it's NOT AS IMPORTANT. No friends or family, his MAMMA ABHORS HIM. She regrets it massively, should have GOT AN ABORTION. His care and attention are NOT IN PROPORTION so he could LEAP IN A NOOSE but even the BEAMS IN HIS ROOF wouldn't WANNA SUPPORT HIM!

After the depressed line, youve already introduced the personal about him being depressed, so we get it already. But it seems like after that, you just keep dragging out the depression and suicidal personal out over the length of a few concepts.. But the concepts are just talking, not actually hard hitting flips or anything creatively done with them. Not as important.. Momma abhors him.. The last line about the support beams was where you finally got to the creative flip part of the concept, but by then you had dragged out the entire setup of the bar not with hard hitting flips to that personal.. But with basically filler just all to setup the final hit. So, in my opinion, youre wasting valuable time and room in your verse where you could be flipping these concepts constantly into other creative flips. Like let me show you a spot where you did that perfectly..

Example:
His attempt at death was really FUCKED WHEN THE KNOT BROKE; he only watches wrestling cause they JUMP FROM THE TOP ROPE!

THAT was more like what you should be doing. You introduce the personal, and then follow that up with a hard hitting line right after. That tightens the space between concepts and allows for a muchhh better and more concept filled verse as an entirety. If you did that bar I just posted, and followed this formula:

"...introduction to the personal, then hard hitting concept flip./ intro to personal or setup.. Finishing haymaker flip to overall personal./"

In the second to last line, You can switch from using oronyms or humorous lines, like that cheeseburger one etc. Just to switch it up every now and again, but I think by following that formula it will help you close the distance and cut out a loooot of that filler thats just taking up space and talking instead of hitting with personals.

Skizzo · 10-04-2018, 01:38 PM

@UnEtH1CaL You have a very unique style. I read that verse this morning but I wanted to wait till I had a minute to break it down properly and offer some advice.

First of all.
You have a very unique and creative approach to personals, your storyline is extremely effective and the way you flow one concept to another within that storyline is extremely fluent. That being said.. I think where you lack, is in the fact that sometimes you get lost in that storyline and sacrifice actual concepts for them. Its kind of like you're telling a story, but its just that.. A story. Youre not making concepts out of those personals sometimes, just telling the people about the personal. Which sometimes comes off as a really dope concept, but other times it comes out as a long drawn and winded personal that takes too long to reach its peak. Let me give you some examples.

Example:

He says he's depressed, we ALL JUST IGNORE HIM. He say's a mess, it's NOT AS IMPORTANT. No friends or family, his MAMMA ABHORS HIM. She regrets it massively, should have GOT AN ABORTION. His care and attention are NOT IN PROPORTION so he could LEAP IN A NOOSE but even the BEAMS IN HIS ROOF wouldn't WANNA SUPPORT HIM!

After the depressed line, youve already introduced the personal about him being depressed, so we get it already. But it seems like after that, you just keep dragging out the depression and suicidal personal out over the length of a few concepts.. But the concepts are just talking, not actually hard hitting flips or anything creatively done with them. Not as important.. Momma abhors him.. The last line about the support beams was where you finally got to the creative flip part of the concept, but by then you had dragged out the entire setup of the bar not with hard hitting flips to that personal.. But with basically filler just all to setup the final hit. So, in my opinion, youre wasting valuable time and room in your verse where you could be flipping these concepts constantly into other creative flips. Like let me show you a spot where you did that perfectly..

Example:
His attempt at death was really FUCKED WHEN THE KNOT BROKE; he only watches wrestling cause they JUMP FROM THE TOP ROPE!

THAT was more like what you should be doing. You introduce the personal, and then follow that up with a hard hitting line right after. That tightens the space between concepts and allows for a muchhh better and more concept filled verse as an entirety. If you did that bar I just posted, and followed this formula:

"...introduction to the personal, then hard hitting concept flip./ intro to personal or setup.. Finishing haymaker flip to overall personal./"

In the second to last line, You can switch from using oronyms or humorous lines, like that cheeseburger one etc. Just to switch it up every now and again, but I think by following that formula it will help you close the distance and cut out a loooot of that filler thats just taking up space and talking instead of hitting with personals.

KG The Prince · #12 10-04-2018, 04:14 PM

He'd "grow to cause a revolution?" All this BABY'S BIRTH FINNA BRING is an "uprising which is more embarrassing" than a LADY'S SKIRT IN THE WIND!! A judgement's about to COMMENCE ON LETSBEEF.. "Ironic your clueless" since your OFFENSE, IT LEFT ME w/ "proof of flaws in ya schemin" w/ my FORENSIC TECHNIQUES!! When he said he'd get "fresh ideas 'n bring some force" there were TWO GUN SHOTS.. HEARD IN HELL! Like a "kid gettin the wrong transfusion" we'll see the "NEW BLOOD'S NOT WORKIN WELL!!"

KG The Prince · 10-04-2018, 04:14 PM

He'd "grow to cause a revolution?" All this BABY'S BIRTH FINNA BRING is an "uprising which is more embarrassing" than a LADY'S SKIRT IN THE WIND!! A judgement's about to COMMENCE ON LETSBEEF.. "Ironic your clueless" since your OFFENSE, IT LEFT ME w/ "proof of flaws in ya schemin" w/ my FORENSIC TECHNIQUES!! When he said he'd get "fresh ideas 'n bring some force" there were TWO GUN SHOTS.. HEARD IN HELL! Like a "kid gettin the wrong transfusion" we'll see the "NEW BLOOD'S NOT WORKIN WELL!!"

#13 10-04-2018, 04:18 PM

^ lmfao I look forward to this one

10-04-2018, 04:18 PM

^ lmfao I look forward to this one

KG The Prince · #14 10-04-2018, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Row

^ lmfao I look forward to this one

haha you're so funny

KG The Prince · 10-04-2018, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Row

^ lmfao I look forward to this one

haha you're so funny

Skizzo · #15 10-04-2018, 05:49 PM

Lol. Be nice @Row, its all about learning and getting better. We all gotta start somewhere.
@KG I applaud you for coming to look for feedback and trying to get better. You obviously have a lot of work to do in a few different areas, so we will just jump right into it.

Let me pick some areas apart that need work.

Example:
He'd "grow to cause a revolution?" All this BABY'S BIRTH FINNA BRING ..

In the opening statement of your verse, first of all, you dont really set the tone for the overall verse. If you have ever been in english class or practiced essay writing, the opening paragraph is going to be your thesis. It tells the readers what or who youre talking about, and sets the tone for the direction of what youre writing about. A verse is much like that, in the sense that your opener provides your readers or listeners the opportunity to understand the direction you are about to take as well as what youre talking about and who. This is why making such a strong opener is extremely important.

Onto the next problem with it.. Is the fact that your setup should be the wordplay, or setup line to the following hit to make it connect. Born to be a revolution, and following that with all this babys birth finna bring, does not provide a clever enough concept flip to make it a hard hitting line. The wording is really bad and that alone causes the strength of the overall concept to fail in execution. I understand that you were trying to follow that up with the next oncoming line about uprising being more embarrassing part.. But you follow that up with a ladys skirt in the wind concept which has nothing to do with an uprising or a revolution. What you are doing is combining irrelevant subject matter and throwing them together in order to make them fit a scheme, but the problem also is that youre drawing out those concepts too long and using irrelevant concepts that dont fit the subject matter either in a personal or effective way, so it comes off more like jumbled ideas mashed together messily.

Also, im not a fan of the one line concepts, then switch to the next multi. You are not transitioning your multis properly enough to make a proper flow. So, with that, its not only your schemes that become a jumbled mess, but also your flow and structure.

You may be able to slide on one of those things.. But when all that adds up together? You can see how these things start to add up and put an extreme weight on your concepts and overall verse.

Another thing I wanted to add, is this part

Example:
"Ironic your clueless" since your OFFENSE, IT LEFT ME w/ "proof of flaws in ya schemin" w/ my FORENSIC TECHNIQUES!!

Ok? You have no clever flip, again, from wordplay to concept, youre just talking and mixing even more irrelevant ideas together. I want to give you a formula that ive practiced on that may help you when writing your verses. Two of them actually..

The first one being a structure formula..

Structure a bar with these four lines:
1. Introduction to personal or punchline concept.
2. A creative flip to that punchline concept or personal.
3. A setup, involving the scheme / topic of the overall bar.. Leading into
4. The closure. Which involves a punchline flip to the overall concept of the bar.

And as far as making concepts, I think you should try this formula: "Wordplay, "like", Punchline reference.

Im going to show you a bar of mine in which I take a single concept theme, and execute these formulas. Give me a second to find it.

Skizzo · 10-04-2018, 05:49 PM

Lol. Be nice @Row, its all about learning and getting better. We all gotta start somewhere.
@KG I applaud you for coming to look for feedback and trying to get better. You obviously have a lot of work to do in a few different areas, so we will just jump right into it.

Let me pick some areas apart that need work.

Example:
He'd "grow to cause a revolution?" All this BABY'S BIRTH FINNA BRING ..

In the opening statement of your verse, first of all, you dont really set the tone for the overall verse. If you have ever been in english class or practiced essay writing, the opening paragraph is going to be your thesis. It tells the readers what or who youre talking about, and sets the tone for the direction of what youre writing about. A verse is much like that, in the sense that your opener provides your readers or listeners the opportunity to understand the direction you are about to take as well as what youre talking about and who. This is why making such a strong opener is extremely important.

Onto the next problem with it.. Is the fact that your setup should be the wordplay, or setup line to the following hit to make it connect. Born to be a revolution, and following that with all this babys birth finna bring, does not provide a clever enough concept flip to make it a hard hitting line. The wording is really bad and that alone causes the strength of the overall concept to fail in execution. I understand that you were trying to follow that up with the next oncoming line about uprising being more embarrassing part.. But you follow that up with a ladys skirt in the wind concept which has nothing to do with an uprising or a revolution. What you are doing is combining irrelevant subject matter and throwing them together in order to make them fit a scheme, but the problem also is that youre drawing out those concepts too long and using irrelevant concepts that dont fit the subject matter either in a personal or effective way, so it comes off more like jumbled ideas mashed together messily.

Also, im not a fan of the one line concepts, then switch to the next multi. You are not transitioning your multis properly enough to make a proper flow. So, with that, its not only your schemes that become a jumbled mess, but also your flow and structure.

You may be able to slide on one of those things.. But when all that adds up together? You can see how these things start to add up and put an extreme weight on your concepts and overall verse.

Another thing I wanted to add, is this part

Example:
"Ironic your clueless" since your OFFENSE, IT LEFT ME w/ "proof of flaws in ya schemin" w/ my FORENSIC TECHNIQUES!!

Ok? You have no clever flip, again, from wordplay to concept, youre just talking and mixing even more irrelevant ideas together. I want to give you a formula that ive practiced on that may help you when writing your verses. Two of them actually..

The first one being a structure formula..

Structure a bar with these four lines:
1. Introduction to personal or punchline concept.
2. A creative flip to that punchline concept or personal.
3. A setup, involving the scheme / topic of the overall bar.. Leading into
4. The closure. Which involves a punchline flip to the overall concept of the bar.

And as far as making concepts, I think you should try this formula: "Wordplay, "like", Punchline reference.

Im going to show you a bar of mine in which I take a single concept theme, and execute these formulas. Give me a second to find it.

**The Ghost of Freak** · #16 10-04-2018, 05:54 PM

https://www.letsbeef.com/tournament_...727&section=lb

**The Ghost of Freak** · 10-04-2018, 05:54 PM

https://www.letsbeef.com/tournament_...727&section=lb

Skizzo · #17 10-04-2018, 06:18 PM

I said...

… We Seen so much “Water under your bridges” I was like…. How’s the “VIEW FROM THE HUDSON?... WE HEARD IT WAS NEAT”... So All those gunplay stories? We “Dont Believe You, Flat Out!”.... Muthafucka Ima Need some “PROOF WHEN DISCUSSIN THOSE SURFACE BELIEFS”! ... I’ll “Put The Heat To Ya Old Flame”... No “FUEL & COMBUSTION” - “THE FURNACE HAS PEAKED!”... Cause To “Top it Off? We Seen More Patch Ups”, Than A “ROOF IN CONSTRUCTION - WHEN WORKIN WITH LEAKS”.. So after this? It’ll even have “Usain, He’s Bound to Barrier!” No Athletic “MOVES WHEN HE JUMPS WITH A PERFECT TECHNIQUE”!!!//(6) … (You Sayin He’s Bound To Bury Her)

In this bar, I introduced the personal, and continued the theme of the personal by adding creative flips and punchlines throughout. All to do with the relative personal theme I was going with. Everything from the patch ups / water under the bridge concepts all relate to relationship problems.. My concepts stringed together to follow that theme to fit the personal angle I was going with at the time, and I created punchlines using those ideas while relating them altogether.

plus Ya entire GROUPS MADE OF FUCKWITS - NERDS AND SOME GEEKS.... More of a “LUDACRIS BUNCH” THAN DISTURBIN THE PEACE”.. We wouldnt see these “Kids Carrying A Full 9", In a “GROUP OF SUM SLUTS, OR SOME SURROGATE TEENS”.. “Bitch, I Got This In The Bag”, Like “POODLES IN CLUTCHES & PURSES TO SLEEP”... So tag ya friends, call ya Ex’s, Hell even Ya “First-Mate’ll See More Dead Men Walkin, On Deck”, Than the entire “CREW OF THE DUTCHMAN IN TURBULENT SEA’S”!!!//

In this bar, I started my opener about his entire "crew" of people. After opening with my thesis, I follow that with a concept flip, with a punchline reference about ludacris / disturbing the peace, which was also a crew. I continue that, with another concept about his overall crew, and follow that line up with yet another punchline reference, but also, that second to last line stands as a setup to me finishing the bar out with the closure.. Which also uses a "crew" concept. That finishing line closes out the bar concept, and all of the concepts relate to that "crew" themed punchline.

Another example of a fully proper themed line would be this..

See, he Thought “If Ikea Couple Setups? We’ll See His Downfall”... But Bitch You shoulda “KNEW THE INSTRUCTIONS WERE WORTHLESS & CHEAP”, Cause If I put these personals out?... We bout to have more “Cross Examining Going On” Than A “BUDDHIST & MONK, IN A CHURCH WITH A PRIEST” Wit a “PEW FULLA NUNS IN A SERVICE TO PREACH”... I mean, ya bitch? We wouldnt have seen a bigger “Under Cover Snake”, If “meDUSAS THE ONE THAT WAS PURCHASIN WEAVES”, Cause that “Public Affair Involves More Characters” Than the fucking “MOVEMENTS OF TRUMP WHEN HE WORDED HIS TWEETS”!!!//

Once again in that bar, I start off with the introduction thesis, which in this case I decided to make a combination of a simple oronym and mix it with a homonym, and then jumped immediately into the personal aspect. Not only did I bring up the personal though and reference what i was talking about.. But I also provided clever flips, humor, and a ten syllable multi to continue the theme, leading into the execution of the finishing punchline that closed that theme out.

Thats what 4 line structures look like. Hope it helps bro. @KG

---------- Post added at 05:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:09 PM ----------

@FreeK this thread aint about audio. I'll prolly make an audio / track feedback thread in the future, but for now im only doing text feedback. This is to work on writing techniques, audio is more about voice influction and emotion and separate things.. Its a whole nother thing my bro.

Skizzo · 10-04-2018, 06:18 PM

I said...

… We Seen so much “Water under your bridges” I was like…. How’s the “VIEW FROM THE HUDSON?... WE HEARD IT WAS NEAT”... So All those gunplay stories? We “Dont Believe You, Flat Out!”.... Muthafucka Ima Need some “PROOF WHEN DISCUSSIN THOSE SURFACE BELIEFS”! ... I’ll “Put The Heat To Ya Old Flame”... No “FUEL & COMBUSTION” - “THE FURNACE HAS PEAKED!”... Cause To “Top it Off? We Seen More Patch Ups”, Than A “ROOF IN CONSTRUCTION - WHEN WORKIN WITH LEAKS”.. So after this? It’ll even have “Usain, He’s Bound to Barrier!” No Athletic “MOVES WHEN HE JUMPS WITH A PERFECT TECHNIQUE”!!!//(6) … (You Sayin He’s Bound To Bury Her)

In this bar, I introduced the personal, and continued the theme of the personal by adding creative flips and punchlines throughout. All to do with the relative personal theme I was going with. Everything from the patch ups / water under the bridge concepts all relate to relationship problems.. My concepts stringed together to follow that theme to fit the personal angle I was going with at the time, and I created punchlines using those ideas while relating them altogether.

plus Ya entire GROUPS MADE OF FUCKWITS - NERDS AND SOME GEEKS.... More of a “LUDACRIS BUNCH” THAN DISTURBIN THE PEACE”.. We wouldnt see these “Kids Carrying A Full 9", In a “GROUP OF SUM SLUTS, OR SOME SURROGATE TEENS”.. “Bitch, I Got This In The Bag”, Like “POODLES IN CLUTCHES & PURSES TO SLEEP”... So tag ya friends, call ya Ex’s, Hell even Ya “First-Mate’ll See More Dead Men Walkin, On Deck”, Than the entire “CREW OF THE DUTCHMAN IN TURBULENT SEA’S”!!!//

In this bar, I started my opener about his entire "crew" of people. After opening with my thesis, I follow that with a concept flip, with a punchline reference about ludacris / disturbing the peace, which was also a crew. I continue that, with another concept about his overall crew, and follow that line up with yet another punchline reference, but also, that second to last line stands as a setup to me finishing the bar out with the closure.. Which also uses a "crew" concept. That finishing line closes out the bar concept, and all of the concepts relate to that "crew" themed punchline.

Another example of a fully proper themed line would be this..

See, he Thought “If Ikea Couple Setups? We’ll See His Downfall”... But Bitch You shoulda “KNEW THE INSTRUCTIONS WERE WORTHLESS & CHEAP”, Cause If I put these personals out?... We bout to have more “Cross Examining Going On” Than A “BUDDHIST & MONK, IN A CHURCH WITH A PRIEST” Wit a “PEW FULLA NUNS IN A SERVICE TO PREACH”... I mean, ya bitch? We wouldnt have seen a bigger “Under Cover Snake”, If “meDUSAS THE ONE THAT WAS PURCHASIN WEAVES”, Cause that “Public Affair Involves More Characters” Than the fucking “MOVEMENTS OF TRUMP WHEN HE WORDED HIS TWEETS”!!!//

Once again in that bar, I start off with the introduction thesis, which in this case I decided to make a combination of a simple oronym and mix it with a homonym, and then jumped immediately into the personal aspect. Not only did I bring up the personal though and reference what i was talking about.. But I also provided clever flips, humor, and a ten syllable multi to continue the theme, leading into the execution of the finishing punchline that closed that theme out.

Thats what 4 line structures look like. Hope it helps bro. @KG

---------- Post added at 05:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:09 PM ----------

@FreeK this thread aint about audio. I'll prolly make an audio / track feedback thread in the future, but for now im only doing text feedback. This is to work on writing techniques, audio is more about voice influction and emotion and separate things.. Its a whole nother thing my bro.

#18 10-04-2018, 06:26 PM

@Skizzo Fuck it, why not get some great feedback while I can. Here's my last LBT battle. I lost with this verse. Don't go easy on me, I'm serious about imroving.

I said look... Y'all better "Pray For Auto," I'm 'bout ta kill him; I "Swear To GOD" I BELIEVE IT! He be makin' the call to "Make A Wish" to "stop the sick teen/ sixteen" and COP HIM A TREATMENT! Wait. Dude "Been In The Game" since '09? But still hasn't "GOT AN ACHIEVEMENT?" Punches'll "Put Him Out His Misery & Have His Head Bobbin'" 'til him and everyone readin' NODS IN AGREEMENT! Fuck an "L," dude jus' "Autographhed His Death Certificate" and CAUGHT A BEREAVEMENT! 'Cause "When I Snap?" Auto "Fumbles His Lines!" Nothing he's DROPPIN' BEEN DECENT!" When I drop? It's his verse at the morgue- I'll BODY WHAT HE'S SENT! This corny chump's a flake, I'll "One Pump" his breaks and let the slug STOP THA APPEASEMENTS. 'Cause battlin' me? It's a no-no. It shoulda "Thrown Up More Red Flags" than a "Flu Epidemic in COMMUNIST CHINA!" I'll walk all over this cunt like I'm "Knee Deep In Pussy," straight waffle-STOMPIN' VAGINAS! I'm writing nothing but promises, honest. I ain't MAKIN' NO DEATH THREATS! Dude better "Book-it Or Pay Attention" 'cause I ain't TAKIN' NO BETS YET! I swear this motherucker's insane for fuckin'' wit Brayne, this LAME SHOULDA JUS' STAYED HOME! Fuck you and fuck your Autographh, bitch! I'll get your stupid NAME PUT ON A GRAVESTONE!

10-04-2018, 06:26 PM

@Skizzo Fuck it, why not get some great feedback while I can. Here's my last LBT battle. I lost with this verse. Don't go easy on me, I'm serious about imroving.

I said look... Y'all better "Pray For Auto," I'm 'bout ta kill him; I "Swear To GOD" I BELIEVE IT! He be makin' the call to "Make A Wish" to "stop the sick teen/ sixteen" and COP HIM A TREATMENT! Wait. Dude "Been In The Game" since '09? But still hasn't "GOT AN ACHIEVEMENT?" Punches'll "Put Him Out His Misery & Have His Head Bobbin'" 'til him and everyone readin' NODS IN AGREEMENT! Fuck an "L," dude jus' "Autographhed His Death Certificate" and CAUGHT A BEREAVEMENT! 'Cause "When I Snap?" Auto "Fumbles His Lines!" Nothing he's DROPPIN' BEEN DECENT!" When I drop? It's his verse at the morgue- I'll BODY WHAT HE'S SENT! This corny chump's a flake, I'll "One Pump" his breaks and let the slug STOP THA APPEASEMENTS. 'Cause battlin' me? It's a no-no. It shoulda "Thrown Up More Red Flags" than a "Flu Epidemic in COMMUNIST CHINA!" I'll walk all over this cunt like I'm "Knee Deep In Pussy," straight waffle-STOMPIN' VAGINAS! I'm writing nothing but promises, honest. I ain't MAKIN' NO DEATH THREATS! Dude better "Book-it Or Pay Attention" 'cause I ain't TAKIN' NO BETS YET! I swear this motherucker's insane for fuckin'' wit Brayne, this LAME SHOULDA JUS' STAYED HOME! Fuck you and fuck your Autographh, bitch! I'll get your stupid NAME PUT ON A GRAVESTONE!