Lets Beef - Battle Rap Forums - Political Correctness

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122853)

:confused: You're right, ethnicity has nothing to do with political correctness. Even though it's in the definition, and everything.

Yet the pc definition doesn't say anything about racial slurs or racism. So what's your point? You don't have one. And pc is about one's perception of what's said. Meaning, not being pc doesn't mean you use slurs and are a racist but rather talk about controversial matters in a controversial way.

Your interpretation of the meaning of political correctness does not necessitate its semantic definition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122843)

Are you saying that the freedom of speech gives you the right to say whatever you want? It doesn't.

As long as the words you're saying don't put people in harm's way it absolutely does. The right to free speech gives anyone the right to say anything that they want. Can you shout fire in a crowded theater? No. That puts people into potential harm, but calling people names does them no physical damage and, as such, can not and should not be limited by the government.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122843)

There are caveats to the first amendment that deal with things like reputation.

I'm not so sure unless you're talking about the ability to take a civil case against someone. In which case, it's not the government limiting the speech as much as it is giving a person who has been harmed by false statements an opportunity to recoup those damages financially. It's not the same thing at all though. A civil case is one citizen against another. You're talking about the government being able to charge people with a crime for speech and that is a dangerous road to take. Once that Pandora's box is open it can't be closed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122843)

Racial slurs, and derogatory remarks have the capacity to weaken the reputation of entire subsects of society on a cultural level.

I don't think so. You can make the argument that people calling blacks niggers or other slurs in the past is why their situation got so fucked up but I'm going to argue that you're wrong because it wasn't the words themselves that caused slavery, segregation, lynching etc. It was the ideas that lead to the use of those words and you don't need those words to spread those ideas. Look, at what Trump has done. He's not out there screaming "The sand niggers need to go" but he's done a REALLY good job of getting that same ignorant and despicable idea across with out it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122843)

Bigotry and dispiriting speech are not a constitutional right afforded to you by the bill of rights.

Yes they are. The bill of rights neither prohibits or protects you from assholes and idiots. People are allowed to be cunts, legally, as long as they aren't causing damage to persons or property. You can not like that. That's fine. However, you cannot assert that the Constitution doesn't protect fucking dickheads and speech you don't like because that's not the way it works.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122858)

Your interpretation of the meaning of political correctness does not necessitate its semantic definition.

It's the definition. And who are you to complain about being non pc when you make fun of handicapped people? Just last night in chat. Besides, you pretended to be black. Painted your online face black, you of all people shouldn't have shit to say. :grass:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyve SCIENCE (Post 1122864)

Where did I complain?

---------- Post added at 04:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:34 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless (Post 1122859)

Hate speech is criminal speech, and as such cannot be considered free. And SHOULD not be considered free.

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There is no difference between a civil case in which a single party brings charges to another, and that in which a governmental body does so.

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Positions of power bring with them an inherent "stroke"(obligatory wrestling terminology.) And as such have the capacity to influence a large group of people with their words and actions. By many, hate speech can be seen as advocacy of hateful acts. If the president of a country were to condemn an entire sect of the populous a large percentage of people in the country would likely follow suit.

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The bill of rights is not a pass to make defamatory remarks. Hate speech is obscene, and slanderous. As such, it can be considered as constituting the same legal restrictions as any other forms of these examples of behavior.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyve SCIENCE (Post 1122850)

"Never said the NYPD was a trusted organization".. Yet, you source them? I guess you don't know how sourcing works.

"I trust the NYPD over you".. Then why do you believe black people are being targeted by the police? Cuz the NYPD will say it doesn't happen. And It's regular citizens who speak out against police brutality. So do you only believe the police are corrupt when it suits your needs?

I'll let you in on a little secret, the police, DA and the whole judicial system gets raises, promotions, bribes and political clout by making arrests. The more arrests the bigger the budget they get. So of course they're going to always claim crime is on the rise. To get more money and take away more rights. You can't trust those who are paid to keep you in chains, homie.

And your proof of increased hate crimes against muslims is a link to gay guys fighting with some weirdo on a moped. A link with no "conviction" at that? Lol what ever bro. And btw, you're making the claim so the burden of proof is on you. Show me actual convictions of white people committing hate crimes against muslims. Maybe, the increase you speak of was those 4 black people who kidnapped and tortured that white handicapped Trump supporter? They were charged with hate crimes. Lolololol.

I came up with my idea of all the hoaxes being hoaxes after reading twenty articles about twenty hoaxes. If hoaxes weren't so prominent then why couldn't you post an actual hate crime against a Muslim? Nope, just gay guys.

I actually don't watch TV or rely on just websites or any of that. But when I do I listen to all stations, all experts, then follow the stories and leads myself. Ascertain to who's credible and who's not. If you're a far left weirdo or a neocon I definitely won't believe you easily. I read Breitbart, watch Stefan Molyneaux, James Corbett and many others but I also listen to and watch KNPR, CNN, MSNBC and a slew of liberal media. Not to mention, I've studied political science to a far greater degree than most.

"What's a black neighborhood"? LOLOLOL!! Are you serious? Semantics little bro!! You don't know what a black neighborhood is but have no problem identifying a white one. And see this is the problem with pc, you approach this with a smug attitude that you're morally superior to this white racist who's just too inferior to comprehend the reality of it all. When you just admitted black neighborhoods usually are more dangerous. I grew up in a mixed hood and believe me the area that was all black white boys didn't dare go alone lol.. Besides, fool, I've actually donated money time and have done tons of charity work! In these neighborhoods. From the poor to the sick. I've been there. And what, you have some moral high ground over me just cuz of the words you choose to use? Put your money where your mouth is and maybe I'll find you credible.

My hypothetical about black neighborhoods being dangerous has you all bent out of shape. Even though you admitted it yourself. Pc causes you to break with reality apparently.

And I'm not going to argue against classism as that's my dominion. You put all your chickens in the racism coupe.

The argument is about pc being good or not. Obviously, it's not good cuz this convo is not pc. You just make ad hominem attacks by making non pc akin to being racist or using racial slurs. Which it's not.

You're making straw-man arguments...putting words in my mouth, then arguing against those statements I never made. I'm tired of saying "I never said this or that..." so I'll just ignore those parts of your argument. Moving along...
I'm familiar with how most police departments issue arrest quotas and the whole prison industrial complex. You asked for links where an arrest was made and I provided one and asked you to Google the rest. You never asked for links showing convictions. Now you want to disqualify the link because it doesn't talk about a conviction? Lol...okay, I give up bro...you're right, they're all hoaxes. Smh! I did mention hate crimes against Muslims, but I was also talking about a rise in hate crimes in general. When I sourced that NYPD article, the NYPD were talking about a rise in hate crimes period, against Jews, Muslims, Gays, whatever. So you want to discount the article because it wasn't specifically about a hate crime against a Muslim? Whatever it takes man! You won the argument. Lol. I hope you realize that "What's a black neighborhood" was a rhetorical question. I haven't claimed any moral high ground over you because of my choice of words. What I've tried to argue is that 1) people's choice of words often contain implicit narratives...2) some narratives can be threatening or considered dangerous by some minority groups and...3) when they get all "PC" about your choice of words, it is not the truth of what you're saying or your freedom of speech that they are trying to stifle. It is often the narrative, which they consider to be dangerous.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swagga Lee (Post 1122889)

You just sound brainwashed by communist professors when it comes to the whole pc thing. And no, you said muslims were being targeted, I asked for proof and you sent a link about gay guys. And I just thought it was funny that these hate crimes have spiked so much yet all you can find is links about gay guys and even that didn't involve an arrest. Your link disqualified itself honestly. Cuz you said crimes against muslims went up. Donald Trump was also the first nominee for president to have gay pride flags on stage with him. You live in a bubble, a giant echo chamber.

https://media.giphy.com/media/WRMq4MMApzBeg/giphy.gif

PC gets thrown around too much these days, it's the new ignorant.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122867)

Hate speech is criminal speech, and as such cannot be considered free. And SHOULD not be considered free.

Not in America it isn't. It shouldn't be either for two reasons:
1. Allowing the government to limit speech opens the door for further limitation and the American government at this point can not and should not be trusted with that power. It wasn't that long ago that one of California's senators tried to say the government should be allowed to define who is and isn't a journalist so they could limit who could and couldn't act as one and report news. I think we can both agree something like that would be INCREDIBLY dangerous.

2. Prohibition has never stopped something from happening. People will still do something if it's illegal if they want to do it. Besides, look at Canada. They have hate speech legislation and they still treat their first nations people like absolute dog shit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122867)

There is no difference between a civil case in which a single party brings charges to another, and that in which a governmental body does so.

I'm not sure I have the time or the energy to explain the difference between a civil and criminal cases but if you take the time to look it up I can assure you they are two completely different things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122867)

It's already happening and I'm not seeing most of the people following in the Commander in Cheeto's footsteps on this one. Most of the people agreeing with that shit seem like they would have agreed with it already and are just using him as confirmation of they already present bias.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rant (Post 1122867)

That might be your interpretation but thus far, no court or legislation has taken that position that I'm aware of. At this point the general interpretation seems to be that any speech that doesn't cause someone real harm is protected.

Look, I agree that being called a racial slur harms someone emotionally. I've had it happen to me on more than one occasion. Being called a kike right to my face is not an experience that I enjoy or want to have happen again. However, I understand that my feelings being hurt doesn't justify placing someone in a cage or forcing them to pay a fine to the government (In which case the victim would never see a penny of it unless they took up a separate civil suit.) when something as valuable as being able to criticize the government and its actors is at stake. When you open that door you give them the power to potentially punish for saying things like "pardon Snowden" or "Senator Feinstein is a stupid cunt for wanting to allow the government to say who is and isn't a journalist." and that's not a world I, or anyone else should want to live in. Without the ability to criticize government we have no redress for things the government does and no way to do anything about it.

The issue with "political correctness" is that it's determining what is and isn't a "correct" opinion. People are actively working to limit and silence these "incorrect opinions" no matter what their content may be, and because mainstream media falls on the side of political correctness, people are pandering to these ridiculous beliefs.

The issue with more people who say things like "SJW" or "PC culture" is that they often take a hard stance in the other side of the fence, and the hard stance on that side is filled with hatred and negativity.

For example; any black death at the hands of a white police officer. The "PC" side jumps onto "Well this is the absolute worst thing ever, an outrage, this is terrible, something must be done to punish this white cop" while the other side say "this is bullshit. He clearly did this and that to deserve it".

When you break it down, one of these sides is pushing towards looking into the system and putting them on trial, which will decide their fate (although unfortunately they won't accept a decision that doesn't fit their agenda). The other side is immediately dismissing the possibility of murder at the hands of someone in a position of power, for what?

Overall, if you take a hard stance on anything you're in the wrong place. Political correctness is about being a victim and silencing others (for example, Nick has called me homophobic because I personally don't believe there is any need for an LBGTQ+batmansymbol-^% parade). The opposite is about feeling that people SHOULD feel insulted and hurt, even though those people very often have not had to overcome as much adversity to actually feel like they are no longer being insulted and hurt.

In short, stop being a cunt.