Quote:
Originally Posted by NOBLE
I'll admit it's hard to distinguish Moors from Arabs because even the term "Arab" is often used to describe people who would be considered black in today's perspective. North Sudanese and Somalians, for example, are people who are sometimes included under "Arab." Somalia is even a member of the Arab League. But the average Somalian today would be considered black, and the average North Sudanese looks no different from an Ethiopian, who would also be considered black. Let's put it this way. Moors of today are like so-called "Latinos" in the sense that they are of mixed ancestry but may phenotypically resemble one of their ancestors more than the others depending on which region they're from. An Argentinian and a Dominican are both Latinos, but the average Dominican looks a lot more African while the average Argentinian looks a lot more European. There are Tuaregs (a Berber group) living all across North Africa and even some Sub-Saharan countries like Nigeria, Burkina Faso and The Gambia. A Tuareg from Burkina Faso looks a lot different than one from Libya. With that being said, I think it's worth noting that Africans who are very dark-skinned or who may be considered "black" aren't limited to sub-Saharan regions. There are many Sahelian people who are very dark-skinned. Fulanis, another Berber people, live in countries like Nigeria and Senegal, and they look no different than the average Somalian. Going back to the Moors who ruled Spain and much of southern Europe at a certain period, they were specifically from Mauretania, a state that spanned modern Morocco, Mauritania, Niger, and parts of Chad. Going back to that time period, people from that region would more so resemble what today we'd call black even though a lot of them look more Arab or mixed today. It's just like if you asked what did a Mexican look like 500 years ago. They'd look a lot more Native and Azteca than Spanish, because the Spanish admixture hadn't taken place with as much force as is present today. The Arab conquest of North Africa can be dated, so even though your wife who is Kabyle may look "white" , that doesn't necessarily mean her ancestors from 2,000 years ago, or 1,400 years ago, or 600 years looked the same. Many of the indigenous people who inhabited North Africa pre-Arab conquest did not look Arab. The final clue as to the identity of the Moors of Spain was their religion. Believe it or not, it wasn't Islam. The Moors practiced what is called Maraboutism, a syncretic religion based on Islam and traditional West African beliefs. It has a similar relationship to Islam as the Santeria or Lukumi practiced in Puerto Rico, Cuba, and Brazil has to Catholicism. The slave masters were forcing the African slaves they brought to Puerto Rico to convert to Catholicism, so the slaves found an ingenious way to practice their traditional religion under the guise of Christianity. The various African gods became the different Catholic saints. They were practicing voodoo while appearing to practice Christianity. The same thing happened during the Arab conquest of North Africa. They were often being forced to convert to Islam, so they hid traditional beliefs under Maraboutism. How do I know the Moors were Marabouts? They actually went as far as to name themselves after their religion! There were two dynasties of Moors in Spain and southern Europe, the Almoravids and the Almohads. Almoravid comes from Arabic مُرابِط (al murabit), a term which the Marabout Moors used to denote their syncretic religion. They were burned at the stake during the Inquisitions along with Sephardi Jews for practicing "witchcraft." If the Moors of Spain were Arabs, why would Arabs be practicing a syncretic religion rather than the original Islam itself? Also, if you look at the depictions of Moors in Medieval art, it is almost always of a black person. Shakesperes Othello, for example, is almost always played by a black actor. Research some images of the Moor Head in Medieval and Renaissance art. Till today, the Spanish word "Moreno", which is derived from "moor" is used to describe blacks in endearing terms as opposed to "negro" which has a more negative connotation. I have never heard of Spanish speakers referring to Arabs as "Morenos."
|
I'd have to vehemently disagree Berbers were black. I've studied at Islamic centers and the conquest of North Africa and Europe is quite detailed and historically accurate. Not to mention there's depictions of ancient Berbers that Egyptians made thousands of years ago showing the 4 types of man. Berbers were white according to Ancient Egyptian accounts. Berbers were darkened by Arab expansion. Also Arabs are Semitic, like Sephardic Jews . Not African. Any Africans claiming to be Arab would be due to Arab expansionism. The Moors were also a Muslim Kingdom. And 100% Muslim. Moors were the second Muslims to conquer Europe. As Madrid and other cities in Europe were founded by Muslims well before Moors came. And Moors were a coalition of Muslims of all races that fell in the moorish empire. The reason, once again why Moors were veiewed as black is simple, because black Moors, recent converts to Islam reconquered parts of Europe when the moderate muslim empire collapsed. I've taken many college courses that dealt with the occupation of Spain. It's a gigantic misconception Moors were black. There were black Moors tho.
---------- Post added at 11:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 AM ----------
"A marabout (Arabic: مُرابِط, translit. murābiṭ, lit. 'one who is attached/garrisoned') is a Muslim religious leader and teacher in West Africa, and (historically) in the Maghreb. The marabout is often a scholar of the Qur'an, or religious teacher.'
---------- Post added at 11:51 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:49 AM ----------
"Moor, in English usage, a Moroccan or, formerly, a member of the Muslim population of what is now Spain and Portugal. Of mixed Arab, Spanish, and Amazigh (Berber) origins, the Moors created the Arab Andalusian civilization and subsequently settled as refugees in North Africa between the 11th and 17th centuries."
---------- Post added at 11:54 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:51 AM ----------
"The term "Moors" refers primarily to the Muslim inhabitants of the Maghreb, the Iberian Peninsula, Sicily, and Malta during the Middle Ages. The Moors initially were the Berber autochthones of the Maghreb.[1] The name was later also applied to Arabs.[2][3]
Moors are not a distinct or self-defined people,[4] and the 1911 Encyclopaedia Britannica observed that "The term 'Moors' has no real ethnological value."[5] Medieval and early modern Europeans variously applied the name to Arabs, North African Berbers, and Muslim Europeans"
---------- Post added at 12:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:54 AM ----------
The Egyptian Book of Gates is around 3 or 4 thousand years old and depicts Berbers (Libyans) as white. Find an older more reliable source and I'll believe you Berbers were black.