Punishment for false cheating accusations?

[Phil Banks]

Yeah alot of cats trying to expose other people I see alot of people jumping the gun on cheating calls.... can we infrac for that.... i've been accused a few times personally since I got modded and I feel if the accusation is un founded someone gotta pay..... so can I infrac for it or what?

[AfterThought]

Maybe not an infraction, just a warning, but yeah I think we could infract for it.

[Revan]

I think we should be hard on people making false cheating claims. Shit can fuck with someones reputation and there deserves to be a punishment for that.

Im down for banning em tbh.

[John Wick]

Well In my Opinion Facts would have to speak LOUDER than ACTS Example; a mere WORD of mouth from either party SHOULD NOT be viewed or deemed to be sufficient enough to make a determination to BAN or INFRACT ... I mean it really depends on the actual situation at hand to make an ACTUAL CALL on something like this .. But its a great way to reduce fraudulent acts .. Good Shit bro Phil Banks

[IV]

I deleted BLNKs comment in your battle thread, then when he made another thread about it I warned him if he does it again I'll infract him and deleted the thread and he hasn't done anything since. If he does then I'll ban him..

[Phil Banks]

as a rule I think evidence w/e should be pm'd to us we make a decision an give an ok if someone thats a reg user wants to make a thread or w/e..... errbody wanna be a mod an its weird

[John Wick]

as a rule I think evidence w/e should be pm'd to us we make a decision an give an ok if someone thats a reg user wants to make a thread or w/e..... errbody wanna be a mod an its weird

VERY TRUE

[Óðinn]

Yeah alot of cats trying to expose other people I see alot of people jumping the gun on cheating calls.... can we infrac for that.... i've been accused a few times personally since I got modded and I feel if the accusation is un founded someone gotta pay..... so can I infrac for it or what?

So, you mean someone is trying to get under your skin and you want to come out all guns blazing and infract them cos they're saying shit about you??

[Phil Banks]

So, you mean someone is trying to get under your skin and you want to come out all guns blazing and infract them cos they're saying shit about you??



No.... someone made a thread an multiple posts claiming I bit their line.... I got a battle open son.... that shit ain't cool specially when its off base as fuck.... I didnt ban or infract anyone but I think the shits lame

[NOBLE]

I think if you infract people for making false accusation, you're walking a thin line on censorship. I'm not saying its okay for them to be making false accusations either...but battle rap is almost based entirely on false accusations. if I say you're a fag who likes to suck cock, that's probably false but its the type of shit people say all the time in battles and in the forums around here. Saying someone's a cheater is very similar.

[Óðinn]

No.... someone made a thread an multiple posts claiming I bit their line.... I got a battle open son.... that shit ain't cool specially when its off base as fuck.... I didnt ban or infract anyone but I think the shits lame

Ahhh i see. With'cha now....that fucking BLNK guy's a retarded fool anyway. Keeps trying to 'One Up' everyone, he get's so far with me then i actually end up saying to myself, ahhh here fuck it an i put him in his place with a few words an he leaves the forums alone for a while.....Shame really, that ppl need to get attention through bullshit an not through positive battling/making tracks etc.

But that's LB...

[IV]

BLNK did get warned though, I deleted all the swaying bullshit on the battle link thread and he opened a new one anyway

[NOBLE]

Beef and false accusations aren't limited to the battle box, neither is the potential to tarnish someone's reputation limited to forum threads. You can throw "personals" in the battle box that, if plausible, have potential to weaken the opponent's reputation.
Coming out and saying someone's a cheater in a thread isn't necessarily ruining someone's reputation. Neither is the person being accused necessarily "innocent." As a mod, thank goodness for people making such threads, because often times, there is some truth to them and they alert one to things. I shouldn't have to spell this out, but since you ask how can I make the comparison, here's how:
If you call someone a fag in the forums or if you call someone a cheater, those could both be false accusations made in the context of beefing. How tarnishing they are to someone's reputation comes from whether people actually believe it.
I'm saying if you're going to give an infraction because someone calls someone else a cheater and that's a false accusation, are you going to give out infractions every time someone gets called a fag in the forums because that's a false accusation too? Come on. If you're the "innocent" person being falsely called a cheater and its in the context of beef, just suck it up. People aren't going to believe it anyway unless there's some evidence to it.

[Revan]

Maybe its time for a vote of some kind? See whos up for bringing in a form of punishment for false cheating accusation.

Lemme add a poll.

[Óðinn]

Yes....Yes there should be.

[IV]

I think there should be, but only in a battle link thread or on battles. So many people go for pages and pages bout the other one being cheater in a thread about something completely irrelevant

[IV]

Also you need to figure out where line is on 'accusations' also, if it's a personal message to a mod. Is that going to count as false accusations?

[John Wick]

Alright this the deal .. I not beefing with Phil Banks anymore BUT When I accused him of being a biter it WAS based on material I felt was EVIDENCE ..In this case IT was his own words .. Im sure everyone remembers the skit .. and this was old news evidently .. but from my research in those forum threads Phils defense was he doesnt watch URL and some individuals commented saying that its a played bar .. TBH i dont believe that and from the sensitive reactions he gets from ppl calling him a biter steers me in the direction that he did bite .. BUT thats over with now he denies it and Im not wasting my time on the net arguing with someone about that level of shit ,, so i squashed that shit .. MY POINT? an accusation should be thoroughly investigated before resulting in a ban .. the decision also should be made as a whole .. and if its one the staff members being accused he cannot count as a vote in the matter to prevent biased towards the accused Any thoughts towards this method? RULE Jason 2FUEL NOBLE

[John Wick]

i think youre missin the overall point

no one cares about what happened with you and phil

this is a general thread regarding the subject of people pulling cheating accusations out of their ass in order to slander other people

its one thing to have a legitimate case where it looks like someone is biting and to bring that to our attention... its totally another to totally fabricate a cheating accusation to hurt someones rep... thats what we're getting at here

You may have misinterpreted my view I was using US as an example for a situation where theres debatable facts i wasnt reopening an allegation on PHIL and also I was saying that it should be expedited thoroughly before making a decision and the choice should be made as a whole thats all bro ... shrugs

P.S. Fuck you too nigga! i dont care about you either! lol

[Revan]

Exactly. And even in the case of having evidence to go with a claim the proper method to deal with it would be to inform a mod and let them deal with it.

[John Wick]

RULE Jason Agreed

[NOBLE]

Jason, I'd question your ability to boil a pot of water if you can't tell the similarities between A FALSE ACCUSATION and A FALSE ACCUSATION. This is like me saying gold and alluminum are both metals and you calling me dumb for putting them in the same category because gold OBVIOUSLY has a higher value than alluminum. Lol.
Listen genius...of course there's always a difference between how two things could be perceived. Me pointing out where they are similar doesn't negate that, neither does the fact that there are differences negate the fact that there are also similarities.
What I meant by "evidence" was "perceived evidence"...and yes people choose to believe things based on what they perceive as "evidence" including those who believe in god.
My whole point was on censorship and how giving an infraction for a particular false accusation is walking the line because people spew false accusations at each other all the time when they are beefing. Case in point: Phil has publicly accused RULE of being a cheater because of how the whole LBA thing went down with the rules being changed and whatnot and him not being granted an immediate re-match. Him pointing those things out while making the argument could be taken as corroborating "evidence" by those who choose to believe that RULE is a cheater. If he was a regular user, would you give him an infraction for making that accusation if you perceive it to be false?
Most of the time from what I've seen when people make such accusations, they tie it into something the leads them to that conclusion, whether its a line similarity or otherwise. If their conclusion is ultimately deemed false, they shouldn't receive an infraction for raising questions.

[Revan]

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[John Wick]

The Ultimate Justin Bieber Megamix - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDLr1_bPPp4)

LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[NOBLE]

i feel like something very simple is being overcomplicated here

obviously anything goes within the battle box.

but in the forums you cannot fabricate a cheating accusation about someone out of thin air and be able to get away with it. cases like damosth8d where he called out phil for a similar line.. and was actually able to PRESENT 2 similar lines are 1 thing... thats a case with some actual evidence that can be discussed. im talkin people who just bring shit up with NOTHING to back it, that should be infractable because it can hurt peoples rep. whether it can be proven or not is irrelevant. if sandusky somehow got cleared of all his charges.... would u be cool letting him watch your 10 year old son? probably not. evidence has very little influence on if someone believes something or not. if someone makes a thread claiming someone is a cheater that isnt... that could potentially be very damaging to their rep and the person who made the thread should get punished

not even sure how this subject is debatable
Let me put this in another perspective. There are people in the United States who claim Barack Obama is not a U.S. citizen and has falsified his documents. That's an accusation that has the potential to tarnish his reputation. Some of these Birthers have "evidence" to back up their claim, some do not and simply don't like him for whatever reason. Should these people be arrested or otherwise punished for making these potentially damaging accusations?
Personally, I think the Birthers are idiots. But I also think they should be allowed to make those accusations that I deem false because there's this thing called Freedom of Speech. To punish them would be censorship.
That's the same way I feel about people making false accusations of cheating on LB. Whoever makes such a false accusation is an idiot...but I'm concerned that adding an infraction for such a thing could be abused in the future, would stiffle certain forms of expression and may deter some people who have legitimate claims from making it known.

[RhetoriK]

To summarize. I think a false accusation is just as serious as a real one.
If someone's dry snitchin, they SHOULD catch a violation to be perfectly honest..

Proposed solution:
Add a "False Accusation" infraction option in the console.
This way, the culprit loses incentive to try it again. Let
the site keep tally on how many times it happens.

[Óðinn]

obviously anything goes within the battle box.



Exactly....